A little bit about myself

 
Cleave
 
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Cleave
Total Posts:  11
Joined  28-08-2013
 
 
 
24 March 2015 11:11
 

Hi, my name is William Cleave Drummond II but most people just call me Cleave.

I am a freelance graphic artist, painter, and heraldic painter who dabbles in just about everything art related. I first started working with heraldic design in the SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism). I have been a court herald in that organization as well as a research herald, where we would compare designs to make sure that they did not run afoul of real world heraldry. A very daunting task at times. My own arms went through 3 revisions before becoming what you when you look at my profile.

 

Here is the blazon for that design:

Arms: Per chevron throughout Or and Azure a thistle Argent between three garden roses counterchanged.

Crest: On a Wreath Argent and Azure a crossbow Sable loaded with three flaming arrows conjoined at the nock Or enflamed Gules.

Mantling: Azure doubled Argent

Motto: Na Sir ‘s Na Seachain An Cath (Neither seek nor shun the fight)

 

I have also had this registered with the US Heraldic Registry: http://www.usheraldicregistry.com/index.php?n=Registrations.20150203H

 

I am also currently a member of IAAH ( International Association of Amateur Heralds)

 
Joseph McMillan
 
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Joseph McMillan
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24 March 2015 12:11
 

Very attractive arms, but I think I’d blazon them simply "per chevron" since the point doesn’t extend to the top of the shield.  Is there a reason for "throughout?"

(And welcome to the group!)

 
Cleave
 
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Cleave
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24 March 2015 12:48
 

Actually the point is supposed to be all the way to the top. I am working on a repainting of the design

 
Joseph McMillan
 
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Joseph McMillan
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24 March 2015 14:19
 

Ah, I see.  The design will work better that way—the thistle will be less cramped.

 
arriano
 
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arriano
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24 March 2015 16:17
 

Welcome Cleave. Very nice arms. I hope you’ll consider becoming a member of the AHS.

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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24 March 2015 23:41
 

Ditto Arian.  Nice arms, nicely executed; would be a nice addition to our Members Armorial!

Other than the obvious thistle, what was your design rationale for these arms?  (Love the eye candy, curious about the recipe smile )

 
Guy Power
 
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Guy Power
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25 March 2015 11:17
 

Where is the emblazon?  I don’t see any "pretty pictures" (as Seb would say) on this thread nor at the link Cleave has provided.

Did I forget the

http://dianewild.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/secret-handshake-2_1-1.jpg

secret handshake?

 

 

—Guy

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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25 March 2015 17:22
 

Guy - click on "Cleave" next to his avatar, then "Public Profile" which has an image of his arms, nicely drawn, but per chevron not per chevron throughout - I assume he will redraw them at some point to reflect the blazon.

Alternatively, go to the AHS links at the top of this Forum page and click on "Members List" for the list of all Registered Users and find him there, with avatar and arms.  (NOTE to moderators/officers- to me, labeling this link as "Members List" is confusing since it’s really Registered Users; I’d suggest we relabel that link, and modify the "Armorial" link to "Members Armorial" since it only dues-paying Members of the Society.)

 

The USHR link in Cleave’s initial posting, while no image appears there, does have the design rationale I’d asked for earlier - sorry I missed it on first reading.  Eyes are like most light wines, they don’t age all that well.

 

FWIW the blazon with "throughout" suggested to me an allusion to "cleave" (the verb) - but if Cleave (the artist) had that in the back of his mind, he didn’t state it in his USHR rationale.  I was a little surprised to see a Drummond with arms that don’t reflect in some way the typical Scottish Drummond pattern of bars wavy or per fess wavy in red & gold; but of course the Scottish general practice of indeterminate cadency is only optional here, and Cleave’s design, "throughout" or not, is original, unique and visually pleasing.

 
hollywood1765
 
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hollywood1765
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Joined  29-06-2012
 
 
 
26 March 2015 11:07
 

Very nice!!!!!

 
Cleave
 
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Cleave
Total Posts:  11
Joined  28-08-2013
 
 
 
26 March 2015 13:04
 

Here are the arms that I painted in watercolor last night on 03-25-2015. I think it came out well.

http://gallery.elisair.com/var/resizes/Illuminations/wcWCDarms-300dpi.png?m=1427389057

 

You can see larger at http://gallery.elisair.com/Illuminations/Arms-of-William-C-Drummond-II

 

EDIT: And I just submitted my application for membership smile

 
Cleave
 
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Cleave
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26 March 2015 13:42
 

Michael F. McCartney;103700 wrote:

Other than the obvious thistle, what was your design rationale for these arms?  (Love the eye candy, curious about the recipe smile )


Here is the rational that I gave the US registry:

 

In the crest the crossbow is representative of interest in archery with three arrows to light the way. On the shield the thistle is representative of Scottish ancestry with the roses to represent love of nature. The gold and blue is water and light just as is the blue and white is in the wreath and mantling.

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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26 March 2015 21:34
 

Your new watercolor is quite nice.  I see you’ve opted for a different style than your original Scottish-style tilted shield, pot helm facing dexter & motto above.

When you submit your info for our Members Armorial, it would be nice to send both images (perhaps first conforming your original to the "throughout" blazon) - besides the extra eye candy, helps illustrate the flexibility of artistic renderings of the same arms.

 
Cleave
 
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Cleave
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26 March 2015 21:52
 

I can do that, maybe even conform to the heraldic rose as the garden rose in some heraldry is considered an artistic instead of heraldic charge. Once I have it painted up will add it here as well as submit with my other for the armorial.

 
Brad Smith
 
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Brad Smith
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Joined  12-02-2009
 
 
 
27 March 2015 09:22
 

I really like your emblazonment.  Nicely done.

 
Kathy McClurg
 
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Kathy McClurg
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27 March 2015 15:23
 

Welcome Cleave! Ditto all of the above compliments.  I’m happy to see you assume your arms beyond that of the SCA.  SCA heraldry has come a great long way since their initial establishment and I quite enjoy lurking on their social network pages.

Welcome to the mundane!  wink

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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28 March 2015 04:05
 

There’s nothing wrong or improper about a garden rose, so long as the blazon identifies it as such.  The more usual (in heraldry) heraldic rose is, at most, the "default" if nothing else is specified, just as three like charges on a field are assumed to be 2 and 1 unless some other arrangement is specified in the blazon.

This likely isn’t the place to discuss the pros and cons of SCA heraldry, but since Kathy brought it up… smile  Years (decades) ago I was a very junior assistant pursuivant in a minor local branch, and enjoyed being in (or on the outer edges of) the SCA heraldic loop.  Their on-line Ordinary was, and still is, the best such tool I’ve seen.  But when they decided to limit screening submissions against only a relatively small list of well-known real world arms (someone’s "modest proposal"), I lost interest.  If there was to be no real world value to their heraldic screening, it just wasn’t worth my time, or putting up with the bamboo swords, stage names and dress-up business , at least for me.

I have no problem with those who use their SCA arms as their real world arms, IF those arms (like Cleave’s) are well-designed and really unique; but the SCA vetting, standing alone, on purpose isn’t sufficient to prove uniqueness outside of their pretend world.

(Ye rant now endeth.  My lord moderators may of course choose to cleave this portion of ye old post as they may deem most fit.)