Greetings,
Having lived away from the City of Big Shoulders for a few years, Beth and I have now moved back. I’ve been looking at the "seal" of the City of Chicago and wondered about the coat of arms that is included on the seal:
http://www.ngw.nl/int/usa/images/chicago.jpg
I’ve never seen the coat of arms used by itself, but have seen the complete seal used in a few different ways. The Chicago Public Library has a little page about the origins of the seal, but doesn’t same much about the arms HERE. Does anyone know of other civic heraldry in the US that makes use of the national arms with a difference like this? As far as corporate heraldry goes, I think that West Point uses the national arms with a helmet in the centre, but I’m not familiar with any cities that do the same thing.
All this being said, is there anyone that is willing to paint/draw a new version of the Chicago coat of arms? As a city resident, hopefully I can petition the city to make greater use of the shield and maybe even adopt supporters and crest. If I can point to an example of what the arms COULD look like, it might help.
Other than some state, departmental (Federal Govt.), and the two examples you quoted, I am not sure that I have seen the National Coat of Arms used in other seals, differenced or undifferenced. However, I do like your idea regarding the creation of a coat of arms for the City of Chicago. Are you going to incorporate the other symbols in the seal as supporters and crest? Even possibly in the same order they are placed around the shield? The City of Southampton, England does use a form of a ship in its supporters.
Looking forward to seeing the development of the idea of a coat of arms for the City of Chicago.
Cheers,
Hassan
Actually, neither of the pictures on International Civic Heraldry is the current state seal of Alabama. The top picture is the coat of arms, which does indeed have the US arms on the center. The bottom is the seal used from 1868 to 1939. Before 1868 and since 1939, the state seal was/is an outline map of the state with the main rivers. Before the civil war, a quasi-coat of arms (sometimes shown on a seal, sometimes not) was used, with such a map shown on a scroll nailed to a live oak tree.
As for Chicago, a much nicer coat of arms would be just to shield-ize the excellent city flag: Argent four stars (or mullets) of six points in fess Gules between two bars Azure.
http://www.fotw.net/images/u/us-il-ch.gif
Perhaps the garb and other elements from the seal could be used as crest, compartment, etc.
Joseph McMillan wrote:
As for Chicago, a much nicer coat of arms would be just to shield-ize the excellent city flag: Argent four stars (or mullets) of six points in fess Gules between two bars Azure.
Agreed, Joe. Do you have any idea what the origin of the flag is?
David Boven wrote:
is there anyone that is willing to paint/draw a new version of the Chicago coat of arms? As a city resident, hopefully I can petition the city to make greater use of the shield and maybe even adopt supporters and crest. If I can point to an example of what the arms COULD look like, it might help.
While I am all for improving civic heraldry, I would offer a note of caution about producing a "new" coat before hand. My colleagues in the vexillological field advise those seeking to change a flag to first build the need for a new flag and explain why the old is faulty and then help guide the process for a new adoption. They find that when one offers a new design initially, the discussion becomes focused on the new design and its perceived flaws/slights and everyone ends up favoring the old design or unwilling to go forward because of the inability of the group to agree. However, by first articulating the need for a new flag, then the public is invited to participate in a juried process that gives public participation without ending up with the eight-grader’s effort that incorporates everything but the Sears Tower. After ranking by the jury and any necessary fine-tuning, the campaign then turns to the governing body to adopt the winner of the public process.
Hope this helps.
Best,
Hugh
David Boven wrote:
Do you have any idea what the origin of the flag is?
According to American City Flags by John M. Purcell, et al:
"In 1915, Alderman James A. Kearns proposed to the city council that Chicago have a civic flag. The council agreed and established the Chicago Flag Commission, which held a contest and offered a prize for the winning design. This design was submitted on 28 March 1917 and adopted by the city council in the summer of 1917."
The contest winner was Wallace Rice. The original flag had two six-pointed stars. The first is for Fort Dearborn and the second is for the the 1871 Fire.
The City Council added a third star in 1933 for the Chicago’s World Fair and later added a fourth star for the Columbian Exposition. The council also later added various representations to each star, such as industry, transportation, civic pride, etc.
There’s about three pages of material on the flag in the publication. American City Flags is available in the reference section of the Chicago Public Library, according to WorldCat, or you can buy it at the North American Vexillological Association’s website, www.nava.org.
Hugh’s reaction (which I share) is actually a good reason to shield-ize the flag, which is a beloved symbol of Chicago—probably more so than the seal. I agree that an approach of telling the people of a city that their current symbols are deficient is usually a recipe for disaster. But if Dave and others were to say, "The city seal is very nice (cross fingers while saying this), but how about a coat of arms based on the flag that you could use in addition to the seal? The seal could be reserved for embossing on official documents, and the arms could be used for other purposes of identification."
For more about the flag, see http://www.fotw.net/flags/us-il-ch.html#descr
David Boven wrote:
Does anyone know of other civic heraldry in the US that makes use of the national arms with a difference like this?
Not differenced like that, but of course Los Angeles uses the national arms in a quarter of its seal.
Just a thought for abroad.
I have been involved many times in the process of creating or re-designing arms, and I would tend to think that the less you change things, the better it is.
As far as Chicago is concerned, I would tend to consider that the shield inside the seal IS already Chicago’s arms. It is significant, simple, clear, heraldically correct and it is almost 2 centuries old.
To my mind, there is no need to abolish it. The improvements should concern only the external ornaments.
Only the opinion of a foreigner, of course.
Nicolas
Nicolas Vernot wrote:
Just a thought for abroad.
I have been involved many times in the process of creating or re-designing arms, and I would tend to think that the less you change things, the better it is.
As far as Chicago is concerned, I would tend to consider that the shield inside the seal IS already Chicago’s arms. It is significant, simple, clear, heraldically correct and it is almost 2 centuries old.
To my mind, there is no need to abolish it. The improvements should concern only the external ornaments.
Only the opinion of a foreigner, of course.
Nicolas
The supporters, such as they are, should be shown as the blazon describes; for instance, the ship should be shown as touching the shield.
Well…I’ve tried writing a note to the folks at city hall and I was told some basic information about the city’s "crest." They said that if I wanted to get the arms used more often and separate from the seal, I’d have to contact my alderman. I’ve done that now, and am waiting for his response. I’d like to see them adopt the standard achievement parts to make a nice coat of arms that the city can use when the seal is not warranted. We’ll see what happens.
I agree with Joe. The city flag is distinctive, less "busy" than the original garb-on-US-shield, commonly known and accepted as the city’s primary emblem. Also, any flag is potentially merely a banner of a related coat-of-arms, this would merely complete the process in reverse order. Now if the City COuncil can just be dissuaded from adding more stars for every future big event…
Joseph McMillan wrote:
As for Chicago, a much nicer coat of arms would be just to shield-ize the excellent city flag: Argent four stars (or mullets) of six points in fess Gules between two bars Azure.
Just a point of clarification (for myself) why not use Celeste’ instead of Azure. It seems like they really do want sky blue, even though I realize this is a very rarely used color.
Linusboarder wrote:
Just a point of clarification (for myself) why not use Celeste’ instead of Azure. It seems like they really do want sky blue, even though I realize this is a very rarely used color.
Although less so now than formerly; according to the Oxford Guide to Heraldry (and I’ve notice this independently) it has increased steadily since the war.
