Need some direction

 
ESmith
 
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ESmith
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14 January 2007 20:11
 

loaba wrote:

Thanks, Everett.

In the case of a bulls head crest, where could/should the mantling originate from? I had thought to perhaps have it draped over the right horn.


I don’t think I quite understand what you’re asking… the mantling, in most cases, originates from the torse, the wreath on which the crest is set (in your case it would be Or and Vert.  In some cases, like President Reagan’s arms it origionates from the bottom of the crest, as if the animals skin were the mantling… you could do that in your case, but they it wouldn’t have a torse like you’ve shown in your rendering.

 

If you wanted to forgo the helm you might also want to forgo the mantling, for the time being… like the way you’ve got it or in my alternate rendering.

 
loaba
 
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loaba
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14 January 2007 20:20
 

Okay, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think figuring out the mantling may be a bit too much for me. We shall see. smile

Is this what you were suggesting, Everett?

 
Andrew J Vidal
 
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Andrew J Vidal
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14 January 2007 21:14
 

I think the shading needs to be scaled back a little, it’s starting to look more sable with a dot of vert!

 
loaba
 
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loaba
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14 January 2007 21:47
 

Looks fine on my monitor, but I’ll adjust it some.

Much as I like the bull idea, something’s just not clicking for me. I like the bull, I like what I’ve done to it. I like the crude torse too, but overall, the crest just doesn’t look right to me. :(

 
ESmith
 
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ESmith
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14 January 2007 21:54
 

loaba wrote:

Looks fine on my monitor, but I’ll adjust it some.

Much as I like the bull idea, something’s just not clicking for me. I like the bull, I like what I’ve done to it. I like the crude torse too, but overall, the crest just doesn’t look right to me. :(


It is awfully dark… You might try some lighter shades of gray all around, maybe several different ones to add some contrast, on my moniter it looks almost like a black cylinder with horns and ears….  Have you though of just using the horns?  Very common in northern European heraldry.  On the whole I like it, it is a good crest, just needs some work

 
loaba
 
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loaba
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14 January 2007 22:14
 

ESmith wrote:

Have you though of just using the horns?

Yeah, I did, just wasn’t sure if I like the idea or not.


ESmith wrote:

On the whole I like it, it is a good crest, just needs some work

I like the idea of a bull, and what it could symbolize or mean. But yeah, it needs alot of work to look right. I think it might be better in a slightly different configuration, rampant, cutoff at the chest, comes to mind.

Anybody got a decent rampant bull image?

 

Edit

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y249/loaba/rampantelsie.png

 
PBlanton
 
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PBlanton
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14 January 2007 22:31
 

loaba wrote:

Much as I like the bull idea, something’s just not clicking for me. I like the bull, I like what I’ve done to it. I like the crude torse too, but overall, the crest just doesn’t look right to me. :sad:

Maybe it looks odd because it’s not on a helmet. rolleyes A crest is supposed to be just that—a crest, the decoration atop a helm.


from Parker’s Glossary wrote:

Crest, (fr. cimier): a figure anciently affixed to the helmet(fr. casque) of every commander, for his distinction in the confusion of battle, and in used before the hereditary bearing of coat armour


Or maybe that particular style of bull doesn’t look right to you. How’s this one?

http://www.heraldicclipart.com/catalog/B377.GIF

 

All in all, I like the bull’s head idea. It’s different.

 

Take care,

 
 
loaba
 
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loaba
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14 January 2007 22:39
 

PBlanton wrote:

Maybe it looks odd because it’s not on a helmet. rolleyes A crest is supposed to be just that—a crest, the decoration atop a helm.

Hmm, okay, we have conflicting ideas here. Phil says a crest needs a helm to sit atop, and Scotus and Everett both seem to think you can omit the helm and still have a crest.

Who’s right, or is this a grey area?


PBlanton wrote:

Or maybe that particular style of bull doesn’t look right to you.

Yeah, that’s what I’m thinking, I don’t like my original style selection. Your cabossed bull is neat and I’ve seen it before, but I want to stay away from floating heads! :D

The rampant bull I just found is pretty good, but what is the name of the type where the creature is cutoff ‘round the midsection? I think that might be the best choice.


PBlanton wrote:

All in all, I like the bull’s head idea.

Yeah, it is. I think I just need the right head (and shoulders).

 
PBlanton
 
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PBlanton
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14 January 2007 22:53
 

Quote:

Hmm, okay, we have conflicting ideas here. Phil says a crest needs a helm to sit atop, and Scotus and Everett both seem to think you can omit the helm and still have a crest.

Who’s right, or is this a grey area?

It’s not necessarily "wrong" to display a crest and torse sans helm. It has been done successfully many times in the past. I just feel that a crest looks much better if displayed as a crest (read: on a helm).


Quote:

Your cabossed bull is neat and I’ve seen it before, but I want to stay away from floating heads! :grin:

I agree, no floating heads, but I don’t think it would take a great artist to add a neck to the caboshed head. :wookie: That was the best I could come up with on short notice.


Quote:

The rampant bull I just found is pretty good, but what is the name of the type where the creature is cutoff ‘round the midsection? I think that might be the best choice.

I like your newest bull, too! :D The "cutoff ‘round the midsection" would be blazoned as a "demi-bull".

Take care,

 
 
loaba
 
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loaba
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14 January 2007 23:04
 

Okay, just for Phil, I slapped a helm on the thing, next thing you know it got the Guy-treatment. Oh well, hope he doesn’t mind that I just aped his configuration. :D

 
PBlanton
 
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14 January 2007 23:11
 
 
 
loaba
 
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loaba
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14 January 2007 23:14
 

Yeah, I think I need to see ‘em both side by side, but the demi-bull looks like its got some advatages. First, in the demi-bull config, you can make the thing bigger, and that’s always prefferable in my mind. Second, it just looks a bit more solid than the full-body rampant style.

Nice job, Phil! That may just be the winner.

 
PBlanton
 
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PBlanton
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14 January 2007 23:18
 

Or with the bull’s head:

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e221/pblanton/loaba-1.jpg

OK, I’ll stop for the night.

Take care,

 
 
loaba
 
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loaba
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14 January 2007 23:23
 

I think I like the profile the best, but that looks good as well.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y249/loaba/JonathanArms.png

 

Here it is with my crude mantling.

 

Thoughts?

 
Guy Power
 
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Guy Power
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15 January 2007 00:34
 

loaba wrote:

I…Thoughts?


The shield is too large for the Helm/Crest.  The helm should be in proportion to the shield.

 

Try making your helm and crest about 50% larger—maybe more.

 

Oh, and what—prithee—is the "Guy-treatment"?