Preaching Heraldry

 
gselvester
 
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gselvester
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24 August 2008 20:40
 

Today the Gospel reading in church was the part of Matthew’s Gospel in which Jesus renames Simon to be "Peter" (i.e. rock) and says that upon this rock He will build the Church…"and I will give to you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. What you bind on Earth will be bound in heaven. What you loose on Earth will be loosed in heaven".

I actually used an image of the Pope’s coat of arms from the pulpit to illustrate my point about the "power of the keys". I know other Christians interpret that passage in varying ways. This is a forum about heraldry not Scripture so let’s please nip in the bud right now any tangents about what those verses mean.

 

For Catholics it is obviously about the Petrine office. My point is simply that I used heraldry to illustrate my homily at mass today. For those who may be curious about which rendering of the Pope’s arms I used it was the very fine one by Marco Foppoli because of how nicely and prominently he depicted the keys.

 

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/9365/81es9.jpg

 
Chuck Glass
 
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Chuck Glass
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24 August 2008 20:56
 

Wonderful!  Did you plug the AHS while you were at it?  That was the perfect opportunity.  "This message brought to you by the American Heraldry Society…"

 
Madalch
 
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Madalch
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24 August 2008 21:17
 

From the title, I had the mental image of one of my more vehement friends standing on a street corner, yelling that the top of my, I mean his lungs, "A coat of arms is NOT a family crest!!  Burn down the bucket shops!!"

 
Jonathan R. Baker
 
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Jonathan R. Baker
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25 August 2008 12:02
 

That emblazonment by Mr. Foppoli is a very fine one.  I particularly like how he worked a Latin Cross into the ward of the keys.

Kudos to you for using a topic about which you are passionate in your homily.  It can make all the difference!

 
Kenneth Mansfield
 
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Kenneth Mansfield
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25 August 2008 12:42
 

Jonathan R. Baker;62679 wrote:

I particularly like how he worked a Latin Cross into the ward of the keys.


I believe it is quite commonplace for there to be crosses in the wards of keys—so much so, in fact, that our own David Cohen must specifically ask for there not to be crosses in the wards of the key in his arms.

 
 
David E. Cohen
 
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David E. Cohen
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25 August 2008 16:13
 

Kenneth Mansfield;62685 wrote:

I believe it is quite commonplace for there to be crosses in the wards of keys—so much so, in fact, that our own David Cohen must specifically ask for there not to be crosses in the wards of the key in his arms.


rolleyes Yup. LOL

 

Which is not to say that Mr. Foppoli’s work is not very attractive.

 
Alexander Liptak
 
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Alexander Liptak
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25 August 2008 18:49
 

yes, crosses in the pope’s keys has been commonplace for quite some time.  i am actually shocked when i come across keys that do not have them placed in.  with his holiness john paul the great, ive actually seen a cross and an "M" cut out to mimic the arms by denny, i believe.

now, other than the pope’s arms, it would be unusual to make the keys appear with a cross.  unless for a priest of some sort, or a strictly religious man.

 
Jeremy Keith Hammond
 
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Jeremy Keith Hammond
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27 August 2008 14:53
 

David E. Cohen;62690 wrote:

rolleyes Yup. LOL

<hr class=“bbcode_rule” >
lol

 
Joseph McMillan
 
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Joseph McMillan
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07 December 2008 20:36
 

xanderliptak;62700 wrote:

now, other than the pope’s arms, it would be unusual to make the keys appear with a cross. unless for a priest of some sort, or a strictly religious man.


Really?

 

Siebenbaeumen, Germany:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ca/Wappen_Siebenbaeumen.png

 

Bundenthal, Germany:

http://www.gemeinde-bundenthal.de/geschichte/Wappen2-300.jpg

Koepenick, Germany

http://www.jadu.de/berlin/bezirke/koepenick/images/wappen.gif

 

Ellhofen, Germany

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/Wappen_Ellhofen.png

 

Need I go on?

 
Alexander Liptak
 
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Alexander Liptak
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07 December 2008 22:48
 

Please go on, yes.  Germany is known for being a religious nation.  As I said, unless there are religious backgrounds for the person, and in this case civic heraldry, it would be uncommon to use a cross in the keys.  To prove this three month old post wrong more prominently, please show me atheist heraldry that uses crosses, or Muslim, or Jewish if you would.

 
Donnchadh
 
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Donnchadh
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07 December 2008 23:13
 

I would imagine that there is some religiously historical reason for the key with a cross. I guess it wouldn&#8217;t have to be, but my first thought would be some religious connection even if it was historical.

I think Alexander is right in that it is unlikely in the arms of non-Christians, or, corporate entities that don’t have some sort of Christian connection. But, again, I could be wrong.

 

I’d like to see it go on too, but, I’d also like some sort of historical ref for them if possible.

 
Frank Martinoff
 
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Frank Martinoff
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08 December 2008 00:59
Frank Martinoff
 
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Frank Martinoff
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08 December 2008 01:03
 

xanderliptak;62700 wrote:

now, other than the pope’s arms, it would be unusual to make the keys appear with a cross.  unless for a priest of some sort, or a strictly religious man.


Let’s go back to what was written Alex!

wink

 
Frank Martinoff
 
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Frank Martinoff
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08 December 2008 01:41
 

xanderliptak;65019 wrote:

please show me atheist heraldry that uses crosses, or Muslim, or Jewish if you would.


:siren:  :shock: :oops:

 

What is the percentage here .... in comparison to the rest,

to be able to come to any sort of conclusion!!

 

:|

 
gselvester
 
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gselvester
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08 December 2008 01:44
 

xanderliptak;65019 wrote:

...To prove this three month old post wrong more prominently…


Yes, since this thread was three months old I injected something new into it and changed the subject. This was obviously ignored so that we could rehash an old discussion which is really off-topic anyway so that some kind of argument could be pursued.

 

Stay on topic and dial down the heat, please.

 
gselvester
 
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gselvester
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08 December 2008 01:45
 

Last Sunday the readings at mass for the Second Sunday of Advent included the prophecy of Isaiah which says:

"Go up on to a high mountain, Zion, herald of glad tidings; cry out at the top of your voice, Jerusalem, herald of good news! Fear not to cry out and say to the cities of Judah: Here is your God!"

 

and the part of Marks gospel discussing St. John the Baptist who, I have long contended, should be (along with the Archangel Gabriel) a patron saint of heralds and heraldists which says:

 

"As it is written in Isaiah the prophet: Behold, I am sending my messenger ahead of you; he will prepare your way. A voice of one crying out in the desert: “Prepare the way of the Lord, make straight his paths.” John the Baptist appeared in the desert proclaiming a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins."

 

Needless to say I was able really to go to town in preaching about these. I don’t post these for their religious/theological significance but because of their use of the imagery and function of a herald. My congregation got a crash course in what a herald is this morning!