Cool thanks for that
I meant now I’m undecided between bordure or no bordure
I want to thank you guys and gals for all of your input it was all very helpful
thanks for making a newbie feel welcome!
hollywood1765;94436 wrote:
Wow Kathy McClurg your shield is great! I still have a LOT to learn
I love the you have it emblazoned by different artists
Thank you for the compliment. I am quite happy with the arms and I love having a variety of emblazons.
For my rational (if you don’t want to search all over the threads here): http://www.armorial-register.com/arms-us/mcclurg-ka-arms.html
I still vote "lose the Border" and remember to allow for artistic license (don’t worry about how mantlings and such turn out - let the artists work solely from you blazon once you pin it down).
I also agree with Michael McCartney - Don’t rush it. Let this one go to the refrigerator and start again with a blank - maybe thinking of family history - special locations and such - the options at the beginning are rather endless.
http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r498/hollywood1765/crestmedivaloldstyle.jpg
flipped eagle and blended chevron into bordure just to see if it works in a more traditional style ala Mr. Mansfield’s post
sorry ‘sorta’ attached to bordure
Please excuse me if I missed it,but what was the meaning of the border? I know you mentioned your thoughts about the other components. Is this just something you like the look of, or does it have some special significance as well?
Actually just something I liked
Whaaaat! Jared Entzminger you put your shield on a football helmet!!!!!!! nice!!!!!!
hollywood1765;94470 wrote:
Whaaaat! Jared Entzminger you put your shield on a football helmet!!!!!!! nice!!!!!!
Actually, it was courtesy of Rob Schreiber! I love it as well. Very cool indeed. :cool:
So if your arms had a bordure and someone copied your arms sans bordure (not a descendant) that would be a completely new set of arms?
hollywood1765;94519 wrote:
So if your arms had a bordure and someone copied your arms sans bordure (not a descendant) that would be a completely new set of arms?
The very old English rule (laid down by Richard II in the Scrope-Grosvenor controversy) is that the addition of a bordure is appropriate to differentiate between the arms of kinsmen but inadequate for strangers in blood.
I don’t know that anyone has ever ruled authoritatively on the subtraction of a bordure, possibly because it’s unusual (and arguably not the best heraldic practice) to design original arms with one. But that’s a theoretical discussion for another time. I would say based on the Scrope-Grosvenor precedent that it would be a usurpation for someone unrelated to you to take the arms you’ve designed, remove the bordure, and then use them as his own.
Joseph McMillan;94520 wrote:
The very old English rule (laid down by Richard II in the Scrope-Grosvenor controversey) is that the addition of a bordure is appropriate to differentiate between the arms of kinsmen but inadequate for strangers in blood.
I don’t know that anyone has ever ruled authoritatively on the subtraction of a bordure, possibly because it’s unusual (and arguably not the best heraldic practice) to design original arms with one. But that’s a theoretical discussion for another time. I would say based on the Scrope-Grosvenor precedent that it would be a usurpation for someone unrelated to you to take the arms you’ve designed, remove the bordure, and then use them as his own.
I have no knowledge of this so I am basing this solely on my opinion, but I would agree with what Joseph said. To me, seeing a bordure usually makes me think that it’s a mark of differentiation of arms. So if I saw that the bordure was suddenly removed I would go one step back and think that those arms would belong to the father (or some other family member). To see a completely unrelated person using the same arms without a bordure would be very odd to me.
What Joe said.
By (probably inept) analogy, if I steal a painting, I can’t make it really "mine" by removing the frame.
If one were to remove the boerder AND make additional changes, that might be a different matter—IF the additional changes, standing alone, would be sufficient to create a distinctive new design.
Thanks guys very informative!
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/5451/woodsonshieldnohighligh.jpg
I know how some feel about the bordure but I still hope that you like
I’m having a more traditional version emblazoned by a heraldic artist
I like the arms just fine, even with the (unnecessary) bordure. They are very nice for an individual effort, particularly by a novice (that’s meant as a compliment). But I have to admit I look forward to seeing a more traditional version.