Personal Arms

 
Ben Foster
 
Avatar
 
 
Ben Foster
Total Posts:  208
Joined  12-05-2006
 
 
 
04 December 2006 09:22
 

One thing I like about the second design is that it is simply a reversal of tinctures.  I understand that this was commonly employed by armigers as a way to difference their arms from those branches of the family that remained in England.

 
Linusboarder
 
Avatar
 
 
Linusboarder
Total Posts:  732
Joined  20-08-2006
 
 
 
04 December 2006 10:20
 

PBlanton wrote:

OK, I guess I’m in the minority here, but I like the first one better.

 


Me too. I like the arrow in chief better.

 
ESmith
 
Avatar
 
 
ESmith
Total Posts:  550
Joined  15-11-2005
 
 
 
04 December 2006 12:23
 

PBlanton wrote:

OK, I guess I’m in the minority here, but I like the first one better.

Of course I have a natural affinity for sable charges upon an argent field. LOL

 

Take care,


2 for the first, 2 for the second… guess you’re not in the minority anymore :smile:

 
Guy Power
 
Avatar
 
 
Guy Power
Total Posts:  1576
Joined  05-01-2006
 
 
 
04 December 2006 13:06
 

I like this one better:

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/4838/coa4zb0.jpg

WAIT!  I like the above better than the red chief; however, overall I like this one best:

http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/4953/coa2vo6.jpg

The chief in the first example detracts from the beautiful simplicity of the basic shield.

 

—Guy

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
Avatar
 
 
Michael F. McCartney
Total Posts:  3535
Joined  24-05-2004
 
 
 
07 December 2006 15:10
 

One practical problem with arms based on three hunting horns—a very nice design concept—will be maintaining uniqueness.  Variations in color and/or addition of ordinaries may produce duplicates or near-duplicates of existing arms of various armigerous families named Hunter or Forester or Foster etc.—there are undoubtedly more.  Ifyou are directly & provably descended from one of those families (in this case, a Foster family which bore heraldic arms—you’re home free.  If not—e.g. Foster but no proven genealogical descent from a particular set of Fosters who bore or bear a particular coat of arms—then of course you must either difference sufficiently for a stranger in blood or start frest.  While a chevron is a very suitable ordinary for arms with three charges arranged 2 & 1, it is also one of the most commonly used ordinaries & thus a greater likkelihood of duplication or too-close-for-comfort similarity. Pretty much ditto for a fess or bend, or parting the field by any of these three divisions & counterchanging—quite attractive but more likely to have already been "done" by others..

The horizontal arrow, standing alone, is IMO both distinctive (if you draw it a bit fatter than life) and much less likely to have been used in this context before (fesswise between three hunting horns) whatever the chosen color scheme.

 

FWIW…

 
ESmith
 
Avatar
 
 
ESmith
Total Posts:  550
Joined  15-11-2005
 
 
 
07 December 2006 17:23
 

Michael F. McCartney wrote:

The horizontal arrow, standing alone, is IMO both distinctive (if you draw it a bit fatter than life) and much less likely to have been used in this context before (fesswise between three hunting horns) whatever the chosen color scheme.

FWIW…


ooooo… that sounds nice, do it that way! grin

 
Ben Foster
 
Avatar
 
 
Ben Foster
Total Posts:  208
Joined  12-05-2006
 
 
 
09 December 2006 11:44
 

I can establish decent from Forster of Hunsden.  Just to be sure, I had a Y-DNA test done about a year ago (like a COA, this is only passed from males to males), and it matches with others who have also independantly established descent from this family.  As an aside,  I am a big proponent of Y-testing, as it can really help to resolve pedigree "road blocks".

I am playing with a few alternatives at the moment, and will post them soon.  All of these comments are really helpful.

 
Ben Foster
 
Avatar
 
 
Ben Foster
Total Posts:  208
Joined  12-05-2006
 
 
 
10 December 2006 18:00
 

Here is the latest.  As always, comments are appreciated.

http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/1866/coa5tt0.jpg

 

I agree that three hunting horns are seen in a number of COAs: Forster, Foster, Forrester, Hunter.  With respect to the first three there is a familial connection.  With respect to Hunter, the horns allude to the similar origins of all of these occupational surnames.

 

However, I would like to preserve the three hunting horns with the chevron.  The arrow on a gules chief, while intended as a method of difference, also alludes to the arms of two of my ancestors, Robert Hale and William Gerrish.  Moreover, my first son is named "Hale Gerrish."

 

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/4307/halegerrishhh2.jpg

 
ESmith
 
Avatar
 
 
ESmith
Total Posts:  550
Joined  15-11-2005
 
 
 
10 December 2006 18:10
 

Ben Foster wrote:

http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/1866/coa5tt0.jpg


Is the motto supposed to read ".. Ffoster" I think that might be a typo

 
Andrew J Vidal
 
Avatar
 
 
Andrew J Vidal
Total Posts:  567
Joined  13-10-2006
 
 
 
10 December 2006 19:32
 

I like that design very much, you succeeded in "differencing" your arms, and making the difference a personal one.  I think it’s a very attractive, well thought out CoA.

 
PBlanton
 
Avatar
 
 
PBlanton
Total Posts:  808
Joined  06-11-2005
 
 
 
10 December 2006 21:44
 

Ben,

Very nice achievement! :cool:

 

The only thing I might change would be to make the crest larger in order to balance the proportions between sheild, helm, and crest.

 

I also like the connection you have made between your own achievement of arms and those of your ancestors.  Good job! :D

 

Take care,

 
 
Donnchadh
 
Avatar
 
 
Donnchadh
Total Posts:  4101
Joined  13-07-2005
 
 
 
11 December 2006 00:35
 

Well… I guess I’ll play the spoiler. :(

 
Guy Power
 
Avatar
 
 
Guy Power
Total Posts:  1576
Joined  05-01-2006
 
 
 
11 December 2006 13:41
 

ESmith wrote:

Is the motto supposed to read ".. Ffoster" I think that might be a typo


ff is actually the capital F written in older form.  "ff" was erroneously adapted as the correct spelling of the family name ffolkes.

 
Guy Power
 
Avatar
 
 
Guy Power
Total Posts:  1576
Joined  05-01-2006
 
 
 
11 December 2006 13:47
 

Ben Foster wrote:

Here is the latest.  As always, comments are appreciated ....

However, I would like to preserve the three hunting horns with the chevron.  The arrow on a gules chief, while intended as a method of difference, also alludes to the arms of two of my ancestors, Robert Hale and William Gerrish.  Moreover, my first son is named "Hale Gerrish."


I agree with Denny that the Chief Gules is a bit much.  Didn’t Mike McCartney suggest two arrows points upwards on the chevron Vert?  I like that better than the chief.  Actually, the Gules an arrow fesswise Or between three hunting horns, 2 & 1 (in your current avatar) looks very fetching!

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
Avatar
 
 
Michael F. McCartney
Total Posts:  3535
Joined  24-05-2004
 
 
 
11 December 2006 16:01
 

Guy, it was Denny (I think) who suggested the two arrows chevronwise on the black chevron.  I much preferred (& on artistic grounds still prefer) the single arrow fesswise between the three horns; or possibly the red chief with the gold arrow dropped down to a fess—though this would likely require a whole lot of vetting for difference from existing arms.

After rereading tbhe thread, and especially the Y-DNA verification of descent from Foster of Hunsden and the two related red shields with gold arrows. (Hale & Garrish) however, some version using the chevron & one or more arrows makes more sense—sometimes one’s artistic preferences should bow to the genealogical or symbolic.  The black chevron is preferable genealogically (also fewer colors) since it will require very little vetting—just enough to make sure no one else has so differenced the F of H shield.  The chevron in red would add a color (not fatal) and require a bit of looking to see if any other family or "name" has a red chevron between black horns, which IMO would be a "fatal" flaw.