David Pritchard;44766 wrote:
The banded garbs look very good in the chief. The arms would still be unique without the dovetailing. Is there a specific reason why you want this partition line?
The dove-tailed partition was/is a nod to our Pentecostal heritage. Not necessary, I just threw it in there for kicks.
JRB
David Pritchard wrote:
The only problem that I have with the crest is the height of the crook as it seems very large in comparison to the standing bear. I think that the bear’s arms should be in the same position and height that is like the arm in your example closest to the viewer.
Sheesh….picky, picky, picky….
David Pritchard wrote:
May I suggest that the bear be armed, eyed and langued Argent/Or rather than Gules? The arms and crest already use two metals and two colours and it would be nice not to add an additional colour.
I armed, eyed, and langued the bear Gules simply to give it a ferocious look. I don’t really think the arming, eyeing, and languing of the bear will make a dramatic addition to the color pallate of the arms, but what the heck…
Is this better?
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e221/pblanton/BakerCrest3.jpg
Take care,
PBlanton;44771 wrote:
Is this better?
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e221/pblanton/BakerCrest3.jpg
The changes are wonderful! Looks just like the Black Forest umbrella holder that I had in mind.
Jonathan R. Baker;44770 wrote:
The dove-tailed partition was/is a nod to our Pentecostal heritage.
A rather tenuous connection to Pentecostalism is it not? The dove is the allegorical representation of the Holy Spirit; Pentecostal worship is centered around the Holy Spirit. But what is the connection of a specific carpentry joint to Pentecostalism other than the coincidental name reference to another symbol?
David Pritchard wrote:
A rather tenuous connection to Pentecostalism is it not? The dove is the allegorical representation of the Holy Spirit; Pentecostal worship is centered around the Holy Spirit. But what is the connection of a specific carpentry joint to Pentecostalism other than the coincidental name reference to another symbol?
Since the flame is another symbol of the Holy Spirit and Pentecost, what if the garbs, as proposed by John Duncan, were set aflame? It would definately make an interesting looking coat of arms! 
Take care,
And we could say that they are fueling the baker’s oven! :D
Two birds with one stone!
David Pritchard;44774 wrote:
A rather tenuous connection to Pentecostalism is it not? The dove is the allegorical representation of the Holy Spirit; Pentecostal worship is centered around the Holy Spirit. But what is the connection of a specific carpentry joint to Pentecostalism other than the coincidental name reference to another symbol?
That was the intention, that the allusion be subtle. At least more so than plonking a flaming dove in the middle of the shield.:D
Well, tomorrow’s the day I have my pow-wow with the family, so I should have some more direction by the end of this weekend.
JRB
JB,
It really is straining the definition of "subtle" to claim that the dovetail partition is an allusion to the Pentecostal dove.
Well, it seems that the dovetail partition is about as popular as Sarge’s wreath (it didn’t do so well in the chat room either), so unless my family just flips over it, we’ll go another direction.:D
JRB
JB,
I like it as a design; it is one of my favorite.
I think it would look even better on your shield if it were fimbriated Argent.
PBlanton;44776 wrote:
Since the flame is another symbol of the Holy Spirit and Pentecost, what if the garbs, as proposed by John Duncan, were set aflame? It would definately make an interesting looking coat of arms!
Take care,
You leave my Garbs alone Philip 
John
Well, the family has all left to go home, but it was a productive visit. In addition to my parents and grandparents, my aunt drove over from Nashville and we hammered out what we liked best. John Duncan will be happy to know that the garbs carried the day with the final color scheme adopted being something like this:
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y155/jonishairy/Heraldry/BakerFinal-3.gif
And for the crest, the salient bear holding a shepherd’s crook as posted by Phil Blanton.
All that remains is for my grandfather, father and myself to create personal badges/mottoes.
So, I’ll take a stab at blazoning the shield and crest:
Shield—Vert, thirteen estoiles Argent, on a chief Sable fimbriated Or three garbs of the same, banded Vert.
Crest—A bear salient sable armed, eyed, and langued Or, grasping a shepherd’s crook of the same.
Now, I don’t trust my blazoning abilities at all, so if there are any errors in the above I thank you to point them out.
Also, now that the design is settled upon, how far should I proceed to have made a good-faith attempt to make sure that the design is unique and doesn’t infringe upon anyone else’s achievement?
Thanks,
JRB
The final design looks very nice indeed! I agree, the garbs look much better than the peels.
The only thing that I can see (and don’t take my word for it as my blazoning is still in it’s infancy) is if you want the estoiles to be layed out exacly as you have them emblazoned here I would specify it. As in, "...13 estoiles argent (4-3-4-2)". But that may not be necessary, others will have more experience in this area.
As for good faith, you could look thru the various online armorials and members arms pages to see if your design is too close for comfort.
Jonathan,
I agree with Andrew, the final design is very nice. The only suggestion that I’d have on the blazon is that you forgot to say the chief was dovetailed. :D
Jonathan R. Baker wrote:
John Duncan will be happy to know that the garbs carried the day
Great! Can we set them ablaze now?
Jonathan R. Baker wrote:
And for the crest, the salient bear holding a shepherd’s crook as posted by Phil Blanton.
I feel special now… :mrgreen:
Take care,
It is my belief that the final design of the shield is unique. The fimbriated dove-tailed partition line ensured this. If you were to search for similar blazons, I suggest that you examine English arms granted between 1475 to 1575 for design similarities. There are probably some crests very similar if not even exactly like yours but they are in all likelihood eyed, langued and armed Gules rather than Or.
I would not specify the placement of the thirteen estoiles as you will have more success with alternative shield and flag shapes if there is some flexibility in the arrangement.
