How to Make a Coat of Arms Official

 
eploy
 
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eploy
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11 May 2010 05:48
 

I stumbled upon an internet article:  "How to Make a Coat of Arms Official".  See:  http://www.ehow.com/how_4856614_make-coat-arms-official.html.  The article talks about registering a coat of arms as a trademark.  Interesting to see what is out there….

 
arriano
 
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arriano
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11 May 2010 12:20
 

There’s an opportunity to add comments. Maybe add a link to our Society’s page which deals with trademarking a coat of arms.

 
Alexander Liptak
 
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Alexander Liptak
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11 May 2010 19:55
 

Yes, this seems an article on how to turn your family’s coat of arms into nothing but a company logo.  It should really be clarified this provides no further protection to other renditions or paintings of the arms, and it very well could lead to a company requesting the family to cease and desist using their ancestral arms because trademark law takes priority over ambiguous intellectual property rights.

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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14 May 2010 20:57
 

A trademark, IIRC, is only really valid if the arms are actually used as a trademark in commerce.  However, a trademark - again IIRC - is only protected in the same general line of business; and in any case, all that’s protected is the particular rendition, not the underlying heraldic concept.

There is, of course, some value in any government registration, of showing (proving) actual use of arms at thus-&-such a date.  For that purpose, and recognizing that the actual legal protection is limited, a copyright should be just as good.

 
Peter Harling
 
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Peter Harling
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15 May 2010 16:10
 

Why bother? Why not register with an authority where you will receive a letters patent or similar, eg. Russian or South African? At least you will have something to hang on the wall for your fees.

Regards ..............  Peter

 
Alexander Liptak
 
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Alexander Liptak
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15 May 2010 19:46
 

Registering in South Africa only protects the arms in South Africa, though.  A copyright exists upon creation of a work of art in the US, and lasts for the life of the artist and an additional 70 years, and might be the simplest way to create both protection and have something to show for it.  Using clip art may or may not suffice for copyright protection for a rendition, it would be up to the judge to decide if the layout and design using pre-made clip art meets the threshold of originality.  I would doubt an American judge would find so in most cases.

So, in the case of the painting I made for Mr. Harling’s son, while he and his son holds the intellectual rights of the arms, I hold the copyright.  Intellectual rights on arms tend to be ignored, but copyright does not.  Now, if Mr. Harling or I find his son’s arms used inappropriately, I could sue the individual for violation of my copyright and have their use ceased and perhaps even be reward with damages if there were some sort of mass production or printing without authorization.  Also, my heirs still have the right to sue for the 70 years following my death for unauthorized use of my paintings.  So while not perfect, where Mr. Harling has full control, there is still plenty of protection allotted, though all just must be initiated by myself as the author of the painting.

 

I am not sure how much legal work would be required to pass the copyright to the individual armiger or his family after my death, but I would prefer to leave each armiger or his family as custodian of his arms rather than my family who do not very well understand heraldry or care much for copyright laws.

 
Frank Martinoff
 
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Frank Martinoff
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16 May 2010 05:35
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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20 May 2010 15:29
 

Perhaps easier (legally) than trying to pass on the original copyright, would be to reinterpret the original blazon in a new & original rendition, then copyright that.

Of course no copyright would protect from anyone who did the same—i.e. same blazon but new & different rendition.  Clear violation of heraldic custom but, absent legal protection for arms as such, not illegal.

 

Now if you were to make a series of (likely dozens) of unique emblazonments in every historical or imaginable style, and copyright each of them, that might do the trick—but the cost, both in time/effort of the artwork and registration fees for each rendition, would likely be prohibitive.

 

And in some cases—e.g. very simple (& therefore heraldically desirable) arms composed of simple geometrical shapes (ordinaries), there would likely be no way for the shield itself to be rendered sufficiently unique to copyright in the first place.

 
Alexander Liptak
 
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Alexander Liptak
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20 May 2010 19:39
 

In the US, a copyright exists upon creation of the work.  You used to have to register the work, and thus pay fees, but anymore that is merely a formality that proves a date certain and provides a bit more legal coverage.  As long as you have an image or photograph of the work with a known date, such as a time stamp by your web hosting company when the image was uploaded, you should be able to argue a date certain and protect your work in most cases.

There is a threshold of labour, diligence and originality to argue a copyright exists.  So creating numerous versions in different styles form clip art is not a guaranteed way to protect your arms because it may be easily found lacking in the labour and diligence, and maybe even originality because you added no "style" to the charges themselves but simply followed a known pattern from your blazon which is also deemed lacking copyright status because it is a description and can not be copyrighted.

 

Which is why people then go back to the logo or trademark idea. Which likewise protects only one rendition, yet provides less protection actually than a copyright considering the conditions and events, and could even result in limiting the use of the image by the armiger himself.  Trademark has much more visible laws and enforcement and seems the safer choice initially though.

 

A big circle that gets you nowhere on protecting the design itself.

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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28 May 2010 19:51
 

Xander—good points all.

Which IMO brings us back to the main - if not only - strictly heraldic value of a copyright, trademark, or other official registration—proof that on thus & such a date certain, you in fact did bear thus-&-such arms.  No legal protection beyond the (non-heraldic) scope of the particular registration, but in the "court of public opinion" (or at least our little corner thereof) it can prove one’s prior moral right to those arms.

 

For that matter, so could any other manner of publishing one’s arms, but the gov’t records do offer greater permanency.

 
Martin Goldstraw
 
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Martin Goldstraw
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03 February 2011 10:57
 

xanderliptak;76643 wrote:

There is a threshold of labour, diligence and originality to argue a copyright exists.  So creating numerous versions in different styles form clip art is not a guaranteed way to protect your arms because it may be easily found lacking in the labour and diligence, and maybe even originality because you added no "style" to the charges themselves but simply followed a known pattern from your blazon which is also deemed lacking copyright status because it is a description and can not be copyrighted.


There is indeed a threshold of labour, diligence and originality and I would argue that such a bar can be achieved even with the use of mere clip art; to which I freely admit. I would fight tooth and nail if anyone denied my copyright to images such as this example which took more than a couple of minutes to knock up!

 

http://cheshire-heraldry.org.uk/visitations/bouth.jpg

 
david
 
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david
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04 February 2011 09:11
 

I understand Alexander’s point, but agree with you, Martin, that this work

of yours can be protected by copyright.

 
David Pope
 
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David Pope
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04 February 2011 09:46
 

Perhaps I’m a bit naive, but I’m not convinced yet that there’s any pragmatic way or even a real need to "protect" personal arms in the US in the first place.  It seems to me that those in the US who are genuinely interested in heraldry and desire to design/register arms will try to ensure they are not duplicating another’s arms.  Those who are going to buy a bucket shop "parchment" are likely too ignorant to care that they are stealing another’s arms and won’t be dissuaded.

A separate issue is the desire to protect a particular piece of art (that just happens to be a blazoning) from being stolen and duplicated by others, so Martin’s points are well taken.  I guess I see this as a difference between protecting the particular artwork (and hard work of the artist) versus attempting to "bootstrap" some form of legal protection for personal arms in the US where no protection exists.

 

David