David Pope;83122 wrote:

I really like the crest currently used as your avatar:  a demi-bear rampant sable…

I agree.  Having him hold a bunch of stuff starts to get busy…

werewolves;83124 wrote:

I agree.  Having him hold a bunch of stuff starts to get busy…

Ok, I’d be willing to concede on the book and stuff.  But can I keep the sword?  I’d like to have that as a reference to my two degrees (I’m a Bruin and Trojan).  I was hoping the book could reflect my two areas of discipline Bachelor’s in English and Master’s in Education.

jcar;83125 wrote:

Ok, I’d be willing to concede on the book and stuff.  But can I keep the sword?  I’d like to have that as a reference to my two degrees (I’m a Bruin and Trojan).

I think holding a Trojan sword is okay, but if that’s what you want it to represent, I’d be specific about it. Unless of course you just want to put a Trojan on your Bruin. :shock:

Quote:

I was hoping the book could reflect my two areas of discipline Bachelor’s in English and Master’s in Education.

The fact that you are using coat armor is allusion enough of your eminence.

Kenneth Mansfield;83127 wrote:

I think holding a Trojan sword is okay, but if that’s what you want it to represent, I’d be specific about it. Unless of course you just want to put a Trojan on your Bruin. :shock:

 

The fact that you are using coat armor is allusion enough of your eminence.

Kenneth Mansfield;83127 wrote:

Unless of course you just want to put a Trojan on your Bruin. :shock:

:D

I’d say that large creatures on a crest probably do better with less accoutrements than smaller creatures, like rats.

I think the demi-bear holding a trojan sword would be the best idea.

So basically this?

Issuant from a wreath Vert, Sable and Argent a demi-bear rampant Sable armed Argent and langued Azure, in his dexter paw a sword Or hilted and pommeled Sanguine

jcar;83109 wrote:

All of this good to know.  Just thought that as long as your basic design was still there you could play with the coloring.  Thanks for clarifying!

While we’re at it I do have a few other questions.  1) is the motto something that from changes from person to person like a crest or is that part of the shield and is passed down?  2) same with the badge?

1)  Depends on country.  From the AHS Heraldic Primer:  In some countries, such as Germany, mottoes never became part of the heraldic tradition. In other countries, such as Scotland, the motto is granted as an integral part of the arms and cannot be changed without official approval. In countries such as England or the United States, the motto is chosen by the individual bearing the arms and can change from one generation to the next or even on the whim of the armiger.

2) I don’t see specific guidance on badges in the primer, just a bit of history - generally I think they are personal, and I know some authorities grant them eleswhere, but I defer to our more knowledgeable members.

While still deciding between my final two for my fridge test I couldn’t help but look at the new Canadian grants and find a few designs that struck me.  So I thought I would see how they’d look with my ideas.  Any thoughts on these?

1.  Per chevron embowed Vert and Argent (Or?) in chief a semee of acorns stripped and leaved Argent and in base a bear rampant (passant?) Sable

2.  Argent fretty Sable on a chief Vert three acorns slipped and leaved Argent (or on a chief Vert between two acorns slipped and leaved a bear’s head erased Argent)

3.  Argent a bear rampant Sable, on a chief embattled Vert three acorns slipped and leaved Argent

I can picture Jcar walking down the aisle, comparing every female present to his intended…   For his motto, what’s the Latin for the song lyric, "Did you ever have to make up your mind…"?

Any of these new suggestions would, I suppose, make a nice enough coat of arms;  but not IMO better than the front runners already discussed.

My favorite, in agreement with Kathy, is the black bear on gold between three green oak sprigs—that one sings to me!

My second choice would be the green field with fess & bear, all between three oak sprigs (which before I forget, would be better blazoned as "Three acorns slipped and leaved…"—see IIRC the arms of Pike in the latest Canadian on-line additions—with apologies if someone else has already noted this—too many pages of postings!)

but I would make the fess & oak sprigs gold rather than white.  After all, when have you seen an oak tree with white leaves & acorns!—during most of the late summer & fall, most oak trees in California have yellowish-brown foliage.

As an aside—one practical advantage to arms featuring a fess is the relative ease of constructing a banner, since tricolors in any number of color combinations are readily available from companies that supply flags for commercial display—the sort you see around real estate developments and such.  They are likely sturdier, and a lot less work!—than a banner with more complicated field divisions.  (But then, a single-color field is even easier to find ready—made!)

As for your crest—the bear in your avatar is adequate as is—giving his a sword IMO adds little that is unique; have you considered (so as to repeat the cant on the arms) giving him instead, an oak sprig to hold?  That would also repeat the key colors of the arms, either gold or green, or better an acorn Or slipped & leaved Vert.

(And as for the suggestions regarding how to combine references to both Bruin & Trojan—not a popular notion in the Westwood of my day!—that particular added extra would be far enough "south" as not to be visible above the wreath.  Now you could of course, Swiss-style, "enhance" the bear on the fess…but I doubt that would fare well in public display…)

Of course all of this is rather like remarks by an ex-officio member of some board—blather blather yada yada but no vote!

(And before I forget—Go Bruins!—remind me to tell you about tee-pee’ing Tommy Trojan from the air…)

Mike~~

UCLA ‘67

Michael F. McCartney;83436 wrote:

As for your crest—the bear in your avatar is adequate as is—giving his a sword IMO adds little that is unique; have you considered (so as to repeat the cant on the arms) giving him instead, an oak sprig to hold?  That would also repeat the key colors of the arms, either gold or green, or better an acorn Or slipped & leaved Vert.

+1.  I like the bear without any further embellishments, but if your really, really want him to be holding something I second the acorn slipped and leaved vert.

Cordially,

David

Michael F. McCartney;83436 wrote:

I can picture Jcar walking down the aisle, comparing every female present to his intended…   For his motto, what’s the Latin for the song lyric, "Did you ever have to make up your mind…"?

Any of these new suggestions would, I suppose, make a nice enough coat of arms;  but not IMO better than the front runners already discussed.

 

My favorite, in agreement with Kathy, is the black bear on gold between three green oak sprigs—that one sings to me!

 

My second choice would be the green field with fess & bear, all between three oak sprigs (which before I forget, would be better blazoned as "Three acorns slipped and leaved…"—see IIRC the arms of Pike in the latest Canadian on-line additions—with apologies if someone else has already noted this—too many pages of postings!)

 

but I would make the fess & oak sprigs gold rather than white.  After all, when have you seen an oak tree with white leaves & acorns!—during most of the late summer & fall, most oak trees in California have yellowish-brown foliage.

Thanks for the input!

Ironically, a few days before the Canadian grants went up online I was thinking about cotissing the fess and then I saw the Pike arms and really loved it.  I also really liked how his oak sprigs looked as well.  I thought about reversing the colors from the way I have it now but then I’d end up with a white bear again (which I really don’t mind at all but I know others think it’s a polar bear [but polar bears are my favorite animal]).  I am thinking about reversing the colors but making the bear be Or instead of black (or white) and the oak sprigs could then be proper.

Quote:

As for your crest—the bear in your avatar is adequate as is—giving his a sword IMO adds little that is unique; have you considered (so as to repeat the cant on the arms) giving him instead, an oak sprig to hold?  That would also repeat the key colors of the arms, either gold or green, or better an acorn Or slipped & leaved Vert.

(And as for the suggestions regarding how to combine references to both Bruin & Trojan—not a popular notion in the Westwood of my day!—that particular added extra would be far enough "south" as not to be visible above the wreath.  Now you could of course, Swiss-style, "enhance" the bear on the fess…but I doubt that would fare well in public display…)

:rofl: I don’t I need to have any "enhancements" on the shield (Swiss-style or otherwise).

Actually, I had already thought about having a bear holding the oak sprig for my crest but decided against it because it’s essentially the same thing as my shield (a bear and oak sprig).  I thought it would end up being very redundant and wanted something a little different from the shield.  I see the crest as being "me" while the shield is my family so to have the same thing in the crest isn’t really showing me as an individual.  This may not be the best or proper way to look at it makes sense to me.  lol

Quote:

(And before I forget—Go Bruins!—remind me to tell you about tee-pee’ing Tommy Trojan from the air…)

Mike~~

UCLA ‘67

I’d love to hear the story!

Swapping colors on the "fess" version & making the bear gold instead of white sounds workable—and a gold Bruin is definitely OK!  (Hmmm…how about a blue fess?—probably not, too many extra colors, but had to suggest it.

The cottises on the Canadian Pike coat look nice, but remember that your bear isn’t (hopefully!) gonna be drawn as long & skinny as the fish, so the cottisses in that case don’t eat up space your bear will need.

RE: the crest—why not use the bear & oak sprig crest as the family "default" (i.e. for those who like it) and then personalize your own crest with the big knife?

[I’ll PM the TP story… fun but way off-topic (though if I said the Trojan (the Greek warrior, that is) was "debruised of" the TP "over all" maybe that would fly…]

Michael F. McCartney;83515 wrote:

Swapping colors on the "fess" version & making the bear gold instead of white sounds workable—and a gold Bruin is definitely OK!  (Hmmm…how about a blue fess?—probably not, too many extra colors, but had to suggest it.

The cottises on the Canadian Pike coat look nice, but remember that your bear isn’t (hopefully!) gonna be drawn as long & skinny as the fish, so the cottisses in that case don’t eat up space your bear will need.

 

RE: the crest—why not use the bear & oak sprig crest as the family "default" (i.e. for those who like it) and then personalize your own crest with the big knife?

 

That’s what I was thinking.  The bear/oak sprigs could be a default for those that want it (which, right now is no one).  And my personal one would be the bear/sword.  I am ok with all of that. 

I do like the look of the cottise but I can see how it will tighten up around the bear.  I was just thinking it might help make the acorns a little smaller so everything will be roughly the same size.

jcar wrote, "I do like the look of the cottise but I can see how it will tighten up around the bear. I was just thinking it might help make the acorns a little smaller so everything will be roughly the same size."

I’m not sure that making the acorns smaller would be a good thing—smaller is less visually distinct.  Also, smaller acorns & leaves would fill less of the available horizontal space—generally speaking arms will look better if there is less rather than more of the field (background) showing—the principle (rule of thumb) that charges should ideally fill the available space.

But if you do want the acorns & leaves just a little bit smaller, then rather than cottisses, how about making the fess just a bit wider & grow the bear to fit?