New member to begin designing arms (Schrenk)

 
Alexander Schrenk
 
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Alexander Schrenk
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Joined  27-07-2011
 
 
 
01 August 2011 16:28
 

Well, I caved and purchased a membership. A major reason I did so was to receive some design assistance with a personal coat of arms.

So… here goes.

 

Some personal background that may be helpful: My name is Alexander Joseph Schrenk. I’m 22 years old, and born and raised in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. I recently graduated from Duquesne University (Pittsburgh) with a bachelor’s in classical languages and philosophy; I have been accepted to the priestly formation program at Saint Paul Seminary for the Roman Catholic Diocese of Pittsburgh. God willing I will be ordained a priest in about six years.

 

I’ve been attracted to the efficient symbolism and interesting history of heraldry since high school, plus it’s fun to doodle coats of arms in the margins of notebooks. I’m currently making a very thorough study of Fox-Davies’ Complete Guide to Heraldry to shore up the somewhat scattered heraldic education I’ve given myself so far.

 

I’ve given some thought to a personal coat of arms, but nothing has passed what I hear people here calling the "refrigerator test" yet.

 

That said, I will share some of the things that are important to me:


<ul class=“bbcode_list”>
<li>A connection to the city of Pittsburgh or the Roman Catholic Diocese of Pittsburgh.</li>
<li>Devotion as a Roman Catholic (especially to the Eucharist, the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin, St. Anthony of Padua, and St. Joseph); my parish growing up was dedicated to the Assumption; my current parish is named after St. Boniface.</li>
<li>Family connections and traditions, though none of my ancestors were armigerous as far as I’m aware. My surname is German. Rietstrap does list a blazon for a family named "Schrenk von Notzig" (Gules, on a bend argent an arrow sable), but I am under no delusion that those arms belong to me in any way. My father’s father was a welder, his father was a carpenter, and his father was a butcher. Other surnames in my family include Meyer, Garbe, and Lotte on my father’s side. My mother is half Greek [Karakatsanis], and half Irish-and-Anglo-Saxon-Southern-USA-mix [Toney, Griffith, Baker, Johnson].</li>
</ul>
I have a working design at the moment.

 

http://schrenk.us/coas/working arms.png

 

I like the charges in chief, the crosses pattées-arrondies being from the Diocese of Pittsburgh’s arms (though maybe a fess chequy argent and azure is more distinctive and has the bonus of a connection to the Pittsburgh’s civic arms as well), and the six-pointed star representing the Assumption. The main charge is what I’m having difficulty on. The pelican-in-her-piety is an image from a mosaic on the baldacchino of my parish, an allegory for the Eucharist which has always had a place in my imagination.

 

Another charge I’ve contemplated is an elm tree eradicated and flammant. There was a 500-year-old elm tree that grew in the park next to my home, the oldest east of the Mississippi river, and a symbol of the borough of Bellevue; it was struck by lightning when I was a kid and had to be taken down. I like the idea of this because it’s not explicitly religious (I don’t necessary need my arms to look like a diocese’s just because I’m a seminarian), though it could have a visual parallel to the Burning Bush of the Old Testament.

 

So that’s where I am right now. Thank you all in advance for your criticism and assistance.

 
Joseph McMillan
 
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Joseph McMillan
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01 August 2011 18:13
 

Like the items in chief; I’d go with the elm tree rather than the pelican.  More personal.

 
Alexander Schrenk
 
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Alexander Schrenk
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01 August 2011 18:47
 

Joseph McMillan;86524 wrote:

Like the items in chief; I’d go with the elm tree rather than the pelican.  More personal.


That makes me want to change the color of the field so it would be something like: Argent, an elm tree eradicated and flammant proper and in chief, a six-pointed star between two crosses pattées-arrondies, all azure.

 

For some reason I don’t like the idea of making the tree or or argent against a background of gules.

 

Edit: I guess I could do something like Argent, an elm tree eradicated and flammant proper and on a chief gules, a six-pointed star of the first between two crosses pattées-arrondies or.

 
j.carrasco
 
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j.carrasco
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01 August 2011 19:15
 

Joseph McMillan;86524 wrote:

Like the items in chief; I’d go with the elm tree rather than the pelican.  More personal.


I agree.  I think I’d like to see the tree on the shield over the pelican.  But I really like the pelican as well.  Maybe that could be moved up to your crest?

 
Alexander Schrenk
 
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Alexander Schrenk
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01 August 2011 19:30
 

j.carrasco;86527 wrote:

I agree.  I think I’d like to see the tree on the shield over the pelican.  But I really like the pelican as well.  Maybe that could be moved up to your crest?


I like that idea, but should I be ordained in six years I will lose the crest for the black galero. Not that I plan on "skimping on it" now for that reason, of course. I could always keep some iteration of it as a badge or something.

 
Alexander Schrenk
 
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Alexander Schrenk
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01 August 2011 23:40
 

Okay, I’ve done some thinking (and drawing) and I’m not entirely satisfied with having the chief there. Here’s basically the same thing, but instead

http://schrenk.us/coas/arms2.png

 

Argent, an elm tree eradicated and flamant proper; a six-pointed star of the first between two crosses pattées-arrondies or on a chevron gules overall. (If that’s how you would blazon that.)

 
werewolves
 
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werewolves
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02 August 2011 00:01
 

Argent, an elm tree eradicated and flamant proper; over all on a chevron Gules a six-pointed star Argent between two crosses pattées-arrondies Or

A bit much red-on-red for my taste.

 
j.carrasco
 
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j.carrasco
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02 August 2011 00:02
 

i really like the burning tree it’s shame to cover it all up with the chevron and charges.  I would almost just take the other charges out and just leave the burning tree.

 
J. Stolarz
 
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J. Stolarz
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02 August 2011 00:07
 

Could you place the burning tree below the chevron, and move the chevron to the top?

 
Alexander Schrenk
 
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Alexander Schrenk
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02 August 2011 01:47
 

werewolves;86552 wrote:

Argent, an elm tree eradicated and flamant proper; over all on a chevron Gules a six-pointed star Argent between two crosses pattées-arrondies Or

A bit much red-on-red for my taste.


I reckon you were right about that.


j.carrasco;86553 wrote:

i really like the burning tree it’s shame to cover it all up with the chevron and charges.  I would almost just take the other charges out and just leave the burning tree.


This appeals for my desire of simplicity.

 

What if I kept the six-pointed star:

 

http://schrenk.us/coas/arms3.png

 

(I removed a bough of the three so the star wouldn’t seem crowded into the corner there; I could find a more seemly way to emblazon that later.)


J. Stolarz;86555 wrote:

Could you place the burning tree below the chevron, and move the chevron to the top?


Not a bad idea. I gave this a try, however, but it ended up seeming just like the chief; it seemed to limit the tree in a way that didn’t seem right to me. (And then, dead space in the area outside of the chevron.)

 
j.carrasco
 
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02 August 2011 03:06
 

damase;86568 wrote:

What if I kept the six-pointed star:

 

http://schrenk.us/coas/arms 3.png

 

(I removed a bough of the three so the star wouldn’t seem crowded into the corner there; I could find a more seemly way to emblazon that later.)

 


I definitely like the way the tree looks without the chevron placed over it.  Hwever the star seems a little crowded in the corner.  What do you think about placing the star in a canton instead?  Maybe an azure canton (or maybe go back to the gules) with an argent star?  I think it will help the star stand out a little more.

 
Alexander Schrenk
 
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Alexander Schrenk
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02 August 2011 03:16
 

j.carrasco;86570 wrote:

I definitely like the way the tree looks without the chevron placed over it.  Hwever the star seems a little crowded in the corner.  What do you think about placing the star in a canton instead?  Maybe an azure canton (or maybe go back to the gules) with an argent star?  I think it will help the star stand out a little more.


That could work:

 

http://schrenk.us/coas/arms4.png

 

Although I’ve always been a little cagey about the use of cantons. (I think they’re best used as a difference or to mark membership in, say, a religious order, where all the members of the order bear a uniform canton in their arms.)

 

Actually, to go with your earlier suggestion, I think there’s something sort of exciting in the simplicity of having just the burning tree:

 

http://schrenk.us/coas/arms5.png

 
Claus K Berntsen
 
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Claus K Berntsen
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02 August 2011 04:19
 

Just the burning tree reminded me of the arms of the Church of Scotland, but upon closer examination, I find that they have a burning bush on the cross of St. Andrew.

Not to close then! Go right ahead, if you wish!

 
Jay Bohn
 
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Jay Bohn
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02 August 2011 05:21
 

damase;86571 wrote:

That could work:

http://schrenk.us/coas/arms4.png

 

Although I’ve always been a little cagey about the use of cantons. (I think they’re best used as a difference or to mark membership in, say, a religious order, where all the members of the order bear a uniform canton in their arms.)

 

Actually, to go with your earlier suggestion, I think there’s something sort of exciting in the simplicity of having just the burning tree:

 

http://schrenk.us/coas/arms5.png


Simpler is often better; certainly an improvement over trying to crowd too many charges in. If you do still feel the need to add the star, you could put it on a shield hung from the tree,

 
Joseph McMillan
 
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02 August 2011 09:05
 

Okay, now I’m on firmer ground:  I would have to say that although we don’t exactly have a worldwide patent on it, the burning bush is so closely identified with Presbyterianism and the Reformed (Calvinist) churches more broadly that it could convey a strange message for a Catholic seminarian.

There are many examples, including not only the Church of Scotland but also the Presbyterian churches in Ireland, Australia, New Zealand, and Canada, the Reformed (Huguenot) Church in France, and a number of smaller groups including the Evangelical Presbyterian Church in England and Wales and Ian Paisley’s Free Presbyterian Church of Ulster.  It was also used historically by most of the Presbyterian denominations in the U.S., until the graphic design crowd came along and obscured it beyond recognition in the logo of the unified Presbyterian Church (USA).

 
J. Stolarz
 
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02 August 2011 10:02
 

damase;86568 wrote:

I reckon you were right about that.

 

 

This appeals for my desire of simplicity.

 

What if I kept the six-pointed star:

 

http://schrenk.us/coas/arms 3.png

 

(I removed a bough of the three so the star wouldn’t seem crowded into the corner there; I could find a more seemly way to emblazon that later.)

 

 

 

Not a bad idea. I gave this a try, however, but it ended up seeming just like the chief; it seemed to limit the tree in a way that didn’t seem right to me. (And then, dead space in the area outside of the chevron.)

 


If you wanted to keep trying with that design you can keep the tree below the chevron, and have two of the stars in the upper right and upper left corners to fill the space.  But if you felt that it limited the tree anyway, then nevermind :D