cool. thanks.

Ton and Guy, one more question for ya, well, two…

1) What paper do you use? I currently am using watercolor paper, which as you know is not like regular paper; it is textured and thick like canvas or canvas paper for oils and acrylics. Frankly I find it rather cumbersome when it comes time to erase my pencil outlines. It tends to flake off or dull down the paint. Do you use the posterboard/clayboard for gouache or what?

2) While I’ve become better at making the color adhere more uniformly I am still not where I’d like it to be. I’ve found that all the colors are a bit streaky with Purple Lake being the worst of them all. So, less water is essential to maintain the solid color of course, but paint to paper application is where I think I may be having a problem. I have even switched to three different forms of brush, so I can’t see that being the problem. What is your technique there?

The reason I ask is that when you look at the above pic you do not see any streaking and the colors look more like an oil or acrylic and not watercolor. I’m just seeing that even with gouache, which is better than normal watercolor, there is still too much streakiness in the color as one normally finds with watercolor. And for the life of me I can’t see how these masters have come to make this disappear all together.

Thanks.

1) I use aquarel paper which is probably the same as you are using, I never erase out my pencil outlines I draw over them with ink.

This is one method the other one you can use is : make a drawing put it above a lamp put another piece of paper over the drawing and then paint after that you can draw the lines again no erasing necessary.

2) difficult to see where you go wrong, I use a # 2 brush talens 150 which allows me to paint small pieces of the drawing at a time (I have a different brush for each of the colours I use) and makes the paint fairly evenly spread. Not to much water is always ok use a piece of old clot and wipe of the excess amount.

Ton do you paint a small section and let it dry and then go back and paint the next section and let it dry. Etc?

My mistake may be that I paint small areas and let them dry and come back and there is clearly a divisional line. And when I go to smooth that out I wind up butchering the thing. So, I started to just begin and end with whole sections.

For example take these arms: "Or, a cross Gules" I began by painting the field Or and then paint the cross Gules after the whole field of Or has dried. Where as I used to paint each of the quarterings of the field one by one Or and then each branch of cross section by section and that did not work.

As for one, I used to have a light table when I was sin high school. So, I should build one again and use that technique.

Donnchadh wrote:

Ton do you paint a small section and let it dry and then go back and paint the next section and let it dry. Etc?

No you should never do that always paint all of one colour in one go.

I will take your arms as an example I would sart with the white and paint all parts of the shield of that colour ( nowadays I paint all parts of the complete achievement of a colour in one go) then I would go to the yellow parts after that the blue parts and do them, then the grey of the helmet, after that the green parts, then the flesh colour of the arm and then the red.

Now this is not a list of when I apply which colour,  the only rules I follow are :

paint the light colours first (white and yellow)

then the other colours

paint red last.

While this may not be precisely on topic for this thread, the note re: the order of applying the various colors reminded me of a glazed ceramic mug I once made for my brother.  In that case, the order of applying the colors was determined by the melting temperature for each color—hottest first, working towards coolest—so as not to re-melt earlier coats.  IIRC it took three firings, but its been several years…

hmmm…well…i tend to use the white of the paper and then use chinese white for highlights. but i get the idea of lighter to darker. that is what i do now. it makes sense in just about any medium.

mike, i can see the analogy…it’s a good one. plus i have to admit that ceramics was the one art class (medium) i was never any good at… sigh… i actually got a ‘D’ in my high school class in that one and have thankfully avoided it ever since! lol. of course i was a high school athlete as well (two time all-state second team in baseball - not bad #2 catcher in state) and also managed to get a ‘C’ in PE once. lol.

Denny,

Adding to what Ton said about applying the color .... Do it all in one go.  Lay down an area of color and "nudge" it along, maintaining a sort of "blob" edge (so it does not flatten out).  Then, grab more of the same color and touch the brush onto the leading edge of what you just laid down.  This will expand your patch of color without looking like two (or more) separate "patches" of the same color.

I can show you easier than explaining it.

Like Ton, I use cold-pressed watercolor paper.  However, you can also use illustration board.  You can also use hot pressed paper, but I’ve read that cold pressed paper is better.
Quote:

Gouache Papers

Most artists paint with gouache on paper. But the paper has to be heavier than ordinary sketch paper because it will absorb too much of the paint. Watercolor paper is recommended – either hot or cold press, which refers to the paper’s finish. Cold press papers were pressed under cold rollers and have a grained texture. Hot press papers are made very smooth by their passing through hot rollers or very polished rollers. The very rough irregular, bumpy papers you sometimes see are not pressed at all.

Cheers,

Guy

Denny,

Another tutorial for you:

http://www.loggiaserena.com/Parchment/HowTo/BeginningIllumination.pdf

Note here the author says even people in the medieval age had problems with painting large areas using a single color!!! 

—Guy

Thanks Guy. Yours and Ton’s help in this is much appreciated.

I just read through this and loved it except for one thing. The author is wrong on one minor thing dealing with mediums. In that section he says that the mediums he lists are of “suspect permanence”. That is incorrect for two of the mediums he mentions.

One, maybe “magic” markers are su8sepect to fading, however Prismacolor Professional markers are most certainly not. In fact they are designed precisely for their longevity. That is why we Interior Designers and Cartoonists use them. So, professional markers are in fact bleed proof and fade resistant, which previous generations of markers most certainly were not, which is where I think the author gets the info.

Two, the “watercolor pencils” that are developed by Prismacolor are also designed for longevity. In fact when used and left dry they look and act just like a standard colored pencil. However, when ‘wet’ they turn into perfect matches for traditional watercolor. And they are also designed not to be prone to fading. Of course the problem with these is that when wet they are in fact too much like watercolor, as they are very transparent…which for watercolor paintings is great, but I would not use them ‘wet’ for heraldic work as they are too transparent. But, again they aren’t prone to fade.

OK… off my soap box… and no I don’t own stock in Prismacolor…I’ve just used it for some time now and can swear by its merits: it applies and looks like paint yet is more manageable like a marker would be, which is why a cartoonist and an ID would use them.

Thanks again fellas. And wish me luck in mastering gouache over this year. I think that will help me go from being a very good heraldic artist (sorry if that’s arrogant) to maybe moving into the great category… who knows… it’s fun either way.