Mappelthorpe design

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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19 October 2007 21:01
 

Seems to me that its time your Mr. Maplethorpe (wonderful name for canting heraldry!) thinks about the "refrigerator test."  IMO all of the four variants so far have their plusses and minuses, their supporters and detractors.  In the end, its up to Mr. Maplethorpe & family to "pick one up and let the other ones ride…"  Or possible different branches of that family might prefer different variants of three bend wavy versions, which IMO are essentially differenced versions of the same basic arms.

But considering Fr. Guy’s accoount of the evolution of his own arms, they would be well advised to take their time…

 
Sandy Turnbull
 
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Sandy Turnbull
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19 October 2007 22:01
 

Thanks again for the input.

The images were posted off to Glen yesterday with instructions on doing the refridgerator test so I would hope to hear back no earlier than Friday. He’s a guy who certainly knows what he likes and there’s no doubt he’ll have a thing or two to say.

 

For the sake of completeness, one of Fr Byers suggestions is below with a variation.

 

http://heraldry.aussiebulls.org/Mappelthorpev3.jpg

 
Jonathan R. Baker
 
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Jonathan R. Baker
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19 October 2007 22:41
 

Sandy Turnbull;50762 wrote:

http://heraldry.aussiebulls.org/Mappelthorpev3.jpg


Ooh, I really like the one on the left.  It’s gorgeous!

 
WBHenry
 
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WBHenry
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19 October 2007 22:46
 

However, if I understand correctly, you are not only trying to suggest the river he lives upon, but the irrigation system which criss-crosses the area.  That being the case, I prefer the one on the right out of these two.  But I really think the second emblazonment in the batch you did above with the bend wavy cotised gets the idea of river / irrigation across in a more forceful way.  (Might as well tell you while I am at it that I really liked the original you posted…)

 
Madalch
 
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Madalch
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19 October 2007 22:46
 

Jonathan R. Baker;50764 wrote:

Ooh, I really like the one on the left.  It’s gorgeous!


Seconded- I like that one much better than your original proposal.

 
Stephen R. Hickman
 
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Stephen R. Hickman
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19 October 2007 23:36
 

Although the one on the left depicts a river more accurately, the one on the right seems more distinct.

 
Donnchadh
 
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Donnchadh
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20 October 2007 01:04
 

David,
Quote:

To address Dennis’ comments, I would like to ask who has said that simple is bland other than yourself?

Others here on the Nordic heraldry thread IIRC. Nordic heraldry, to which I am the biggest fan, being “too” simple for people in design and execution. It has also been raised at HSS where Nordic heraldic art has been questioned in the same manner. If you want specific names, I do not have the time, so check the Nordic heraldry thread here and some fo the Norse heraldry threads and realted ones questioning the modern style of Scottish heraldry, rather simple IMO, at HSS.

Further, I was making a connection in the number of people who say that there is a “too simple" version of heraldry, like Nordic heraldry, and those who see something as complicated, which in fact is not because it is a trick. I am sorry I was unclear about that. I have found that the number of people who get lost in simple designs through tricking (heraldic art or other art) and those who have a problem with heraldic art that is "too simple". I hope I was clearer now. If not PM me, or simply email me, and I can explain it in more detail perhaps. smile


Quote:

Simple designs can be very striking, that is clean and clear features which were once seen as important in heraldry.

I couldn’t agree more David.


Quote:

Is the first image posted by Sandy the most artistic design?

Yes, but it is more than that.


Quote:

Yes it is, but being artistic does not always coincide with being the best heraldic design. These really are two different matters.

Not necessarily David. This is not an “either or” proposition. Again I refer everyone to the great artistic merit in Nordic heraldry, which some find bland and boring as it generally lacks modeling up of charges either on the field, or the helm, or the crest. I think the best heraldic design is both simple and artistic and that they go hand in hand. In this case, Sandy’s first rendition, it was both and people got lost in the tricking of the design and lost sight of the fact that it IS simple. That was my point. Again I’m sorry I was not clearer before and hope I am now.

P.S. My favorite version of Marco Foppoli’s arms are his plain and simple non-modeled version on his website. Everyone has done them nicely, but this version that he has there is absolutely perfect and that version would be considered by many to be too bland or too simple. This is my point.

 
Donnchadh
 
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Donnchadh
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20 October 2007 01:07
 

Sandy, of the two Or ones, I like #2 but again I prefer the original.

 
MohamedHossam
 
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MohamedHossam
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20 October 2007 01:32
 

I like the first one (bend Murrey) alot more. The other one makes me think of the Spanish flag for some reason, even though it isn’t Gules, but you get the picture. :D

Nice! The colors are very distinct.

 

Is the crest totally settled on?

 

Cheers,

 
ESmith
 
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ESmith
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21 October 2007 12:01
 

Sandy Turnbull;50762 wrote:

http://heraldry.aussiebulls.org/Mappelthorpev3.jpg


This might be a bit off-topic, but would the one on the right be bendlets or a bend voided?

 
Sandy Turnbull
 
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Sandy Turnbull
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21 October 2007 12:14
 

ESmith;50786 wrote:

This might be a bit off-topic, but would the one on the right be bendlets or a bend voided?


Depending on one’s school of thought it would be either a bend voided, or two cottices/costs. Bendlets are usually thicker, averaging between 1/3 and 1/2 the bend.

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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22 October 2007 20:44
 

As between a bend voided vs. two bendlets, where whichever it is falls between two significant charges, IMO its a distinction without any real difference.  That is, again IMO, both blazons describe essentially the same arms.  The technical difference would not IMO be sufficient to avoid infringement, i.e. to claim that they were not the same arms.

If the bend/bendlets stood alone, however, IMO the difference would be real—like comparing the old South Vietnamese flag with the (hypothetical) banner of Or three bendlets Gules in which the three pallets or barrulets are spaced across the whole field.

 
Michael F. McCartney
 
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Michael F. McCartney
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22 October 2007 20:49
 

As between a bend voided vs. two bendlets, where whichever it is falls between two significant charges, IMO its a distinction without any real difference.  That is, again IMO, both blazons describe essentially the same arms.  The technical difference would not IMO be sufficient to avoid infringement, i.e. to claim that they were not the same arms.

If the bend/bendlets stood alone, however, IMO the difference would be real—like comparing the old South Vietnamese flag - gold with three narrow stripes "bunched together"—probably better blazoned as Or on a fess Gules two bars of the field—with the (hypothetical) banner of Or three bars or pallets Gules in which the three pallets or bars are spaced evenly across the whole field.

 

(I’m using bars & pallets interchangeably here since the SVN flag can be flown horizontally from a staff or hung vertically from a crossbar or on a wall, like the one in my office.)

 
Linusboarder
 
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Linusboarder
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23 October 2007 01:24
 

If we’re still giving our 2ยข I am generally not a fan of Or shields. I prefer any of the Vert designs over the Or designs.

No disrespect to Father Guy, Joe McMillan, Dan Gill (all of whom’s arms I like a lot), or anyone else’s who has an Or shield. I just find Or shield’s are less pleasing to my eye

 
Dcgb7f
 
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Dcgb7f
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23 October 2007 01:27
 

Linusboarder;50818 wrote:

No disrespect to Father Guy, Joe McMillan, Dan Gill (all of whom’s arms I like a lot), or anyone else’s who has an Or shield. I just find Or shield’s are less pleasing to my eye

None taken. I’m glad you like it, but in the end, it doesn’t matter what you think… just me. wink